Friday, March 16, 2012

The Real NBA 2K12 Rating List


REAL 2K RADIO!
I've decided to start up my own radio show on BlogTalkRadio.com
The main thing that has always irked me about the "NBA 2K Insider" is that we have no idea who they are, what their credentials are, or how much of a basketball fan they are (I firmly believe it's just a programmer who is merely a casual fan of the NBA, which is why they've never come forward to reveal their so-called ratings "expert"). "Real" 2K Insider isn't just because I am better at this than 2K Sports.  It's because I'm a REAL person who isn't afraid to put their name next to the product.  Adding my voice to the mix provides the community another connection to a person who is really out there who meticulously scouring the entire league to get the most accurate league-wide ratings and tendencies possible.

TWITTER!
Follow me on Twitter @Real2KInsider where you can follow my updates in real time, ask questions, and generally hear me moan about how unbelievably bad the Carmelo Anthony trade was for the Knicks.

THE REAL NBA 2K12!
My player edits for NBA 2K12 are listed here.  At present, 325 players have been edited.

If you are new to this blog, I come up with my NBA 2K edits using various sources Basketball-Reference (most accessible source of "standard" Advanced Statistics, a staple site for any true basketball fan), Hoopdata (most accessible source of shot zone data), 82games (mainly for lineup data and clutch stats), Synergy Sports (video of any play from the last 3 years, used for ratings/tendencies), Draft Express (scouting), ShamSports (100% accurate Contract information) and anything else I can get my hands on (many of these sites didn't exist when I first started editing for NBA 2K3 back in 2002).

FILE NAMEThe Real NBA 2K12 (03-16-12)
360 GTReal 2K Insider


My Rating - Player (Change from 2K's most recent rating)
LU = Last Update.  Rating player held before my most recent edit.
New additions denoted in Bold


TOTAL NBA PLAYERS EDITED: 332 of 429

POINT GUARDS (75 of 83)
94 - Chris Paul (+1) (LU: 91)
92 - Derrick Rose (0)
86 - Rajon Rondo (+1)
85 - Russell Westbrook (-3)
85 - Deron Williams (-3) (LU: 83)
84 - Steve Nash (0) (LU: 85)
82 - Tony Parker (0) (LU: 81)
81 - Stephen Curry (+1) (LU: 82)
81 - Jeremy Lin (+6) (LU: 78)
80 - Kyrie Irving (+2) (LU: 82)
80 - Kyle Lowry (-3)
80 - Ty Lawson (-1) (LU: 78)
80 - Michael Conley (+3) (LU: 78)
80 - Brandon Jennings (+2)
79 - Louis Williams (+5) - Rates 82 @ SG (LU: 78)
78 - John Wall (-4) (LU: 75)
78 - Jrue Holiday (-2) (LU: 77)
76 - Devin Harris (+3) (LU: 75)
75 - Jarrett Jack (0)
75 - Mo Williams (+1) (LU: 73)
75 - Jeff Teague (+1)
75 - Darren Collison (0) (LU: 76)
74 - Isaiah Thomas (+4)
74 - Ricky Rubio (-3) (LU: 78) 

73 - Jose Calderon (+4) (LU: 72)
73 - Mario Chalmers (0) (LU: 69)
73 - Rodrigue Beaubois (-2) - Rates 77 @ SG (LU: 72) 

73 - Ramon Sessions (+1)
73 - Nate Robinson (-1)
73 - Kemba Walker (-3) (LU: 74)
72 - C.J. Watson (+4)
72 - D.J. Augustin (0) (LU: 75)
72 - Raymond Felton (+2) (LU: 75)
71 - Andre Miller (0) (LU: 72)
71 - Jerryd Bayless (+6) (LU: 70)
71 - Jameer Nelson (-4)
71 - Jason Kidd (-6) (LU: 69)
71 - Baron Davis (+1) (LU: 76) 

70 - Jordan Farmar (+2) - Rates 75 @ SG (LU: 73) 
70 - Greivis Vasquez (+6) (LU: 65)
70 - Goran Dragic (+7) (LU: 69)
69 - Beno Udrih (+3)
68 - Brandon Knight (-5)
68 - Luke Ridnour (0) - Rates 74 @ SG (LU: 67)
68 - J.J. Barea (+3) - Rates 72 @ SG
68 - Sundiata Gaines (+8)
68 - Eric Maynor (+4)
68 - T.J. Ford (-1) - Reduced to 25 in all attributes due to retirement
67 - John Lucas (+17) (LU: 65)
67 - Norris Cole (+4) (LU: 69)
67 - Kirk Hinrich (-5) (LU: 70)
67 - Eric Bledsoe (+2)
66 - A.J. Price (+14)
66 - Earl Watson (+3) (LU: 67)
66 - Jonny Flynn (-4)
66 - Will Bynum (-3)
65 - Reggie Jackson (N/A)
65 - Ishmael Smith (-4)
64 - Jimmer Fredette (+1) - Rates 69 @ SG (LU: 62)
64 - Toney Douglas (-5) - Rates 72 @ SG (LU: 65)
63 - Chris Duhon (-3) (LU: 62)
62 - Derek Fisher (-5)
62 - Cory Joseph (+3)
62 - Jeremy Pargo (N/A)
61 - Steve Blake (-3) (LU: 60)
61 - Avery Bradley (0) (LU: 59)
61 - Jerry Smith (N/A)
60 - Jamaal Tinsley (N/A) (LU: 62)
59 - Julyan Stone (N/A)
59 - Walker Russell (N/A)
59 - Mike Bibby (-1) (LU: 60)
58 - Mike James (N/A) 

57 - E'Twain Moore (-8) - Rates 63 @ SG
57 - Darius Morris (N/A)
56 - Donald Sloan (N/A)  - Rates 61 @ SG
54 - Cory Higgins (N/A) (LU: 52)
FREE AGENTS
66 - Gilbert Arenas (-11) - Rates 71 @ SG
61 - Eddie House (0)
61 - Courtney Fortson (N/A)
57 - Carldell Johnson (N/A)
56 - Anthony Carter (+3)
55 - Larry Hughes (N/A)

SHOOTING GUARDS (57 of 77)
95 - Dwyane Wade (-1) (LU: 93)
90 - Kobe Bryant (-4) (LU: 91)
86 - Manu Ginobili (+1)
83 - Eric Gordon (+1)
82 - James Harden (+2) (LU: 81)
82 - Monta Ellis (-2) (LU: 83)
82 - Joe Johnson (-2) (LU: 81)
81 - Jason Terry (+5) (LU: 80)
81 - Chauncey Billups (+2) - Rates 76 @ PG (LU: 78)
81 - Rodney Stuckey (+2)  (LU: 79)
80 - Jamal Crawford (+2) - Rates 77 @ PG (LU: 78) 

79 - Marcus Thornton (+5) (LU: 77)
77 - Tyreke Evans (+1) - Rates 73 @ PG & 77 @ SF (LU: 78)
77 - MarShon Brooks (+5)
77 - Nick Young (+4)
76 - Kevin Martin (-3) (LU: 75)
76 - Ray Allen (-4) (LU: 78)
76 - Delonte West (+7) - Rates 71 @ PG (LU: 75)
76 - Iman Shumpert (+4) - Rates 72 @ PG (LU: 77)
75 - George Hill (+3) - Rates 68 @ PG
75 - Leandro Barbosa (+4) (LU: 70)
74 - Paul George (-3) (LU: 73)
74 - J.R. Smith (0)
73 - Tony Allen (+5)
73 - Jason Richardson (0) (LU: 71)
73 - O.J. Mayo (-4)
73 - Ronnie Brewer (+4)
73 - Courtney Lee (+3)
73 - Richard Hamilton (0) (LU: 74)
72 - DeMar DeRozan (+3)
72 - Evan Turner (+1) - Rates 74 @ SF
72 - Arron Afflalo (+1)
72 - Shannon Brown (0) (LU: 75)
71 - Wesley Matthews (-2)
71 - Rudy Fernandez (+6)
71 - J.J. Redick (+7) (LU: 70)
71 - Ben Gordon (-3) (LU: 72)
70 - Thabo Sefolosha (+2)
69 - Anthony Morrow (+5) (LU: 67)
69 - C.J. Miles (+2) - Rates 71 @ SF
69 - Landry Fields (0) - Rates 71 @ SF (LU: 67)
69 - Gary Neal (+4) (LU: 66)
69 - Gerald Henderson (0) (LU: 70)
69 - Jodie Meeks (+7)
68 - Daniel Green (+6) - Rates 70 @ SF
68 - Shaun Livingston (+10) - Rates 62 @ PG (LU: 69)
68 - Von Wafer (+9)
68 - Dominique Jones (+5)
67 - Mike Miller (+2)
67 - Keyon Dooling (+0) - Rates 62 @ PG (LU: 72)
66 - Reggie Williams (+2) (LU: 68)
64 - Daequan Cook (+1) (LU: 65)
64 - Michael Redd (-5) (LU: 63)
61 - Andrew Goudelock (N/A)
59 - Terrel Harris (N/A)
58 - Jason Kapono (+5) - Rates 59 @ SF
57 - Matt Carroll (+2)
FREE AGENTS
63 - Keith Bogans (-5)
61 - Darington Hobson (N/A)
58 - Mychel Thompson (N/A)

SMALL FORWARDS (65 of 85)
99 - LeBron James (0) (LU: 98)
93 - Kevin Durant (-1) (LU: 90)
85 - Andre Iguodala (-1) (LU: 83)
84 - Rudy Gay (-2) (LU: 83)
83 - Paul Pierce (+1) (LU: 84)
81 - Carmelo Anthony (-7) (LU: 84)
80 - Danny Granger (0) (LU: 79)
80 - Luol Deng (-3) (LU: 78)
79 - Danilo Gallinari (+6)
79 - Gerald Wallace (-4) (LU: 81)
79 - Shawn Marion (0) (LU: 78)
78 - Vince Carter (+2) - Rates 76 @ SG (LU: 77)
78 - Michael Beasley (0) (LU: 77)
77 - Nicolas Batum (-2) (LU: 74)
77 - Wilson Chandler (-3) 

76 - Tayshaun Prince (-1)
76 - Grant Hill (-2)
74 - Marvin Williams (+9) (LU: 75)
74 - Tracy McGrady (+5) - Rates 72 @ SG (LU: 77)
74 - Linas Kleiza (+12) (LU: 71)
74 - Caron Butler (-7) (LU: 79)
74 - Stephen Jackson (-4) - Rates 72 @ SG (LU: 77)
73 - Matt Barnes (+3) (LU: 74)
72 - Shane Battier (-4) - Rates 69 @ SG (LU: 73)
72 - Dahntay Jones (-1) - Rates 70 @ SG
71 - Kawhi Leonard (-1)
71 - Mike Dunleavy (+9) (LU: 70)
71 - Hedo Turkoglu (-3) (LU: 72)
71 - Chandler Parsons (+5) (LU: 69)
71 - Richard Jefferson (-1) (LU: 74)
71 - Alonzo Gee (+4)
70 - James Johnson (+8)
70 - Carlos Delfino (+5) (LU: 72)
70 - Corey Maggette (-4) (LU: 73)
69 - Dorell Wright (-1)
69 - Brandon Rush (+4) (LU: 68)
69 - Wesley Johnson (+2) - Rates 66 @ SG (LU: 70) 

69 - Anthony Tolliver (+9) - Rates 67 @ PF
69 - Terrence Williams (-3)
68 - Rashard Lewis (-1) (LU: 71)
68 - Mickael Pietrus (-4)
68 - Bill Walker (+3) - Rates 65 @ SG (LU: 70)
67 - Corey Brewer (+1) (LU: 66) 

67 - Metta World Peace (-2)
67 - Kyle Korver (+5)
67 - Derrick Brown (+2) (LU: 68)
67 - Jimmy Butler (0)
67 - Austin Daye (+11) (LU: 70)
66 - Gerald Green (N/A)
65 - Gordon Hayward (+2)
65 - Omri Casspi (+4)
65 - James Jones (+7)
65 - Ryan Gomes (+3) - Rates 60 @ PF
65 - Quentin Richardson (-6)
65 - Gary Forbes (0)
65 - Josh Childress (-5) (LU: 67)
65 - Jordan Hamilton (N/A) 

64 - Marquis Daniels (+2) - Rates 62 @ SG (LU: 66)
63 - DeShawn Stevenson (-7) (LU: 66)
63 - Devin Ebanks (0)
63 - Andres Nocioni (-4)
63 - Jerry Stackhouse (-1)
63 - DeAndre Liggins (N/A)
61 - Chris Wright (N/A)
59 - Sasha Pavlovic (+4)
FREE AGENTS
73 - Jeff Green (-1) - Stamina/Durability reduced to 25 for Injury purposes
67 - Andre Emmett (N/A)
62 - Renaldo Balkman (-2)
61 - Larry Owens (N/A)

POWER FORWARDS (65 of 88)
89 - Kevin Love (+3) (LU: 88)
85 - Blake Griffin (0)
85 - Paul Millsap (+3)
85 - Zach Randolph (+2)
84 - Pau Gasol (-1) (LU: 82)
83 - LaMarcus Aldridge (0) (LU: 82)
82 - Dirk Nowitzki (-1) - Rates 86 @ SF (LU: 83)
82 - Josh Smith (-2) - Rates 86 @ SF
81 - Chris Bosh (0) - Rates 83 @ SF
80 - Carlos Boozer (+3) (LU: 81)
79 - David Lee (0) (LU: 76) 
79 - David West (+5)
79 - Elton Brand (0) (LU: 78)
78 - Amare Stoudemire (-5) (LU: 80)
77 - Andrea Bargnani (+3) - Rates 74 @ C and 80 @ SF (LU: 75)
77 - Kris Humphries (+7) (LU: 76)
76 - Serge Ibaka (-2) (LU: 75)
76 - Trevor Booker (+10)
75 - Kenneth Faried (+3) (LU: 70) 

75 - Ryan Anderson (+8) (LU: 74)
75 - Thaddeus Young (+1) - Rates 78 @ SF (LU: 74)
75 - Luis Scola (-2) (LU: 73)
74 - Ersan Ilyasova (+4)
74 - Carl Landry (+2)
74 - Al Harrington (+8) (LU: 73) 

74 - Brandon Bass (+4) (LU: 75)
73 - Antawn Jamison (-1)
73 - Taj Gibson (0) (LU: 71)
72 - Tyler Hansbrough (+3) (LU: 75)
71 - DaJuan Blair (+3)
71 - Derrick Williams (0) - Rates 72 @ SF
71 - Lamar Odom (-7) (LU: 73)
70 - Gustavo Ayon (N/A) (LU: 61) 

70 - Craig Smith (+12) (LU: 72)
70 - Andray Blatche (-1)
70 - Nick Collison (+8) (LU: 70)
69 - Kenyon Martin (-7) (LU: 74)
69 - Tyrus Thomas (-4) (LU: 73)
68 - Jon Leuer (+11) (LU: 65)
68 - Jonas Jerebko (+7) (LU: 67)
68 - Boris Diaw (+3) - Rates 65 @ C and 72 @ SF (LU: 69)
68 - Udonis Haslem (0) (LU: 69)
68 - Lavoy Allen (+11)
67 - JaJuan Johnson (+1)
67 - Hakim Warrick (+5)
67 - Glen Davis (-3) (LU: 71)
67 - Josh McRoberts (+3) (LU: 69)
66 - D.J. White (+5)
65 - Matt Bonner (+15)
65 - Jared Jeffries (+7) (LU: 64)
65 - Reggie Evans (+2)
65 - Jason Smith (+10)
64 - Steve Novak (+12) - Rates 71 @ SF (LU: 58)
64 - Markieff Morris (-2)
63 - Jeff Pendergraph (N/A)
62 - Vladimir Radmanovic (+9)
62 - Ivan Johnson () (LU: 60)
62 - Yi Jianlian (-1)
61 - Shawne Williams (0) - Rates 65 @ SF
61 - Troy Murphy (-5)
61 - Justin Harper (+7) - Rates 64 @ SF
59 - Ryan Reid (N/A)
57 - Luke Walton (-1) - Rates 62 @ SF
55 - Brian Scalabrine (+15) - Rates 58 @ SF
53 - Brian Cardinal (+2) - Rates 58 @ SF
FREE AGENTS
62 - Josh Davis (N/A)
61 - Malcolm Thomas (N/A)
59 - Dennis Horner (N/A)
51 - Mickell Gladness (N/A)

CENTERS (70 of 96)
93 - Dwight Howard (0) (LU: 94)
84 - Andrew Bynum (+1)
82 - Al Jefferson (+1)
82 - Tim Duncan (-2) (LU: 81)
82 - DeMarcus Cousins (+4) (LU: 79)
81 - Kevin Garnett (0) - Rates 83 @ PF (LU: 80)
81 - Marc Gasol (0) (LU: 79)
81 - Roy Hibbert (+5) (LU: 79)
80 - Al Horford (0) - Rates 82 @ PF (LU: 81)
80 - Marcin Gortat (+7)
79 - Joakim Noah (+1) (LU: 78)
79 - Tyson Chandler (+2) (LU: 80)
78 - Greg Monroe (+5) (LU: 76)
77 - Anderson Varejao (+6)
77 - Andrew Bogut (-1)
77 - DeAndre Jordan (+5) (LU: 76)
76 - Nikola Pekovic (+4) (LU: 70) 

76 - Nene (-1) (LU: 77) - Rates 78 @ PF
76 - Emeka Okafor (+3) (LU: 78)
75 - Samuel Dalembert (+5)
74 - JaVale McGee (+4)
74 - Chris Andersen (+9) (LU: 73)
74 - Brook Lopez (-2)
73 - Spencer Hawes (+8) (LU: 72)
73 - Amir Johnson (+6) (LU: 72)
72 - Chris Kaman (-4) (LU: 73) 

71 - Tiago Splitter (+9) (LU: 70)
69 - Anthony Randolph (+1) - Rates 71 @ PF and 72 @ SF (LU: 70)
69 - Omer Asik (+4) (LU: 67)
68 - Drew Gooden (+2) - Rates 70 @ PF (LU: 67)
68 - Brendan Haywood (+3)
68 - Brandan Wright (+9) (LU: 64)
68 - Ian Mahinmi (+3)
68 - Chris Wilcox (+7) (LU: 65)
68 - Kwame Brown (+9)
68 - Chuck Hayes (0) (LU: 72)
67 - Timofey Mozgov (+10) (LU: 63) 

67 - Kendrick Perkins (-4) (LU: 66)
66 - Nikola Vucevic (+5) (LU: 62)
66 - Kosta Koufos (+14) (LU: 61) 

66 - Zaza Pachulia (+6) (LU: 65)
66 - Shelden Williams (+7) 

66 - Larry Sanders (+1) (LU: 64)
66 - Jermaine O'Neal (-2) (LU: 68)
65 - Bismack Biyombo (+9) (LU: 60) 

65 - Byron Mullens (+8)
64 - Nazr Mohammed (+6)
63 - Aaron Gray (+9) (LU: 61)
63 - Andris Biedrins (+2) (LU: 62)
63 - Greg Stiemsma (N/A) (LU: 62)
62 - Kurt Thomas (-1) (LU: 63) 

62 - Johan Petro (+10)
62 - Sean Williams (N/A)
61 - Josh Harrellson (+10) - Rates 63 @ PF & SF (LU: 59)
61 - Vernon Mackwell (N/A)
60 - Joel Anthony (+5) (LU: 59)
60 - Cole Aldrich (+6)
60 - Mehmet Okur (-8) (LU: 64)
59 - Ryan Hollins (+6)
59 - Jeff Foote (N/A)
59 - Eric Dawson (N/A) 

58 - Tony Battie (+11)
58 - Erick Dampier (+3)
57 - Jamaal Magloire (+7) (LU: 56)
57 - Jerome Jordan (N/A)
55 - Jason Collins (+9)
53 - Juwan Howard (-1) (LU: 55)
52 - Dexter Pittman (+2) (LU: 56)
51 - DaSagana Diop (-1)
51 - Eddy Curry (-6) (LU: 55)
FREE AGENTS
76 - Greg Oden (+6) - Reduced to 25 in all attributes due to career threatening injuries
68 - Ronny Turiaf (+6)
64 - Derrick Caracter (+4)
62 - Marcus Cousin (N/A)
58 - Chris Johnson (N/A) (LU: 55) 

56 - Keith Benson (N/A)

TOP UNEDITED PLAYERS
75 - Aaron Brooks - China
74 - Andrei Kirilenko - Russia
74 - J.J. Hickson - Kings
72 - Trevor Ariza - Hornets
72 - John Salmons - Kings
72 - Patrick Patterson - Rockets
70 - Jason Maxiell - Pistons
70 - Martell Webster - Timberwolves
70 - Maurice Evans - Wizards
70 - Joey Graham - Free Agent

EASTERN CONFERENCE
89 Bulls (99 Def, 71 Off) (no change w/ injury to Richard Hamilton)
89 Heat (99 Def, 91 Off) (no change w/ injury to Mike Miller)
86 76ers (94 Def, 77 Off)
84 Celtics (88 Def, 76 Off) (-1 w/ injury to Jermaine O'Neal, Chris Wilcox)
83 Magic (97 Def, 73 Off)
80 Pacers (89 Def, 71 Off) (-1 w/ injury to Jeff Foster)
79 Hawks (74 Def, 89 Off) (-5 w/ injury to Al Horford, Jason Collins, Willie Green)
78 Knicks (66 Def, 91 Off) (no change w/ injury to Bill Walker)
74 Raptors (80 Def, 60 Off)
73 Bucks (76 Def, 60 Off) (no change w/ injury to Kwame Brown)
73 Pistons (60 Def, 81 Off)
72 Nets (72 Def, 60 Off) (-4 w/ injury to Brook Lopez, Damion James)
68 Cavaliers (68 Def, 64 Off) (-3 w/ injury to Anderson Varejao)
67 Wizards (64 Def, 60 Off) (-1 w/ injuries to Rashard Lewis)
64 Bobcats (60 Def, 60 Off)

WESTERN CONFERENCE
87 Mavericks (89 Def, 99 Off) (-1 w/ injury to Delonte West)
85 Thunder (80 Def, 87 Off)
84 Spurs (95 Def, 86 Off)
83 Lakers (82 Def, 75 Off)
83 Grizzlies (78 Def, 89 Off) (-1 w/ injury to Darrell Arthur)
82 Clippers (74 Def, 80 Off) (-2 w/ injury to Chauncey Billups)
78 Nuggets (61 Def, 99 Off)
77 Suns (78 Def, 80 Off)
76 Jazz (70 Def, 72 Off)
75 Rockets (77 Def, 64 Off) (-4 w/ injury to Kyle Lowry)
74 Trailblazers (65 Def, 70 Off) (no change w/ injury to Elliot Williams, Shawne Williams, Mehmet Okur)
72 Timberwolves (61 Def, 60 Off) (-3 w/ injury to Ricky Rubio)
72 Kings (69 Def, 60 Off)
69 Hornets (76 Def, 60 Off) (-11 w/ injury to Eric Gordon, Emeka Okafor, Carl Landry, Jason Smith)
68 Warriors (63 Def, 75 Off) (-6 w/ injury to Andrew Bogut, Stephen Curry)

INTERNATIONAL PLAYER POLICY
Due to the lockout many players decided to play abroad this season.  Some players have out-clauses in their contracts to return at any time, others do not.  Four quality players signed in China and do not have out-clauses but are free to rejoin the NBA after the Chinese season ends in late February/early March.  Rather than reduce all of these players to 25 rating I have decided it best to reduce only their Stamina & Durability ratings to 25 in the interim.  That should lower their overall ratings enough to prevent them from playing prominent roles if signed, and keep their court time to an absolute bare minimum.  When the players re-join the NBA, a player can manually alter their Stamina/Durability ratings during an Association mode (and can likewise adjust all International players when they get to the Off-season of their respective Associations).  I will also apply this policy to Jeff Green and Greg Oden, who will not play the 2012 season due to injury.

INTERNATIONAL LIST (Overall/Stamina/Durability)
PG: Aaron Brooks (75), Eugene Jeter (63/87/75), Sherron Collins (63/76/80), Carlos Arroyo (61/85/85), Acie Law (59/85/70), Mustafa Shakur (55/85/75), Lester Hudson (55/80/82), Chris Quinn (53/85/70),
SG: Chris Douglas-Roberts (69/77/70), Sasha Vujacic (67/77/70), Charlie Bell (64/77/63), Andy Rautins (59/85/70), Garrett Temple (58/85/74), Kyle Weaver (58/77/70), Mario West (50/77/78)
SF: Jeff Green (73/93/85), Andrei Kirilenko (74), Sonny Weems (67/77/70), Al Thornton (66/88/70) Antoine Wright (64/77/78), Jawad Williams (57/70/78), Pape Sy (52/74/70)
PF: Leon Powe (64/77/70), Josh Powell (61/70/85), Pops Mensah-Bonsu (60/85/78), Gani Lawal (56/80/85)
C: Greg Oden (76/81/25), Joey Dorsey (62/77/99), Nenad Krstic (54), Hilton Armstrong (51/70/78), David Andersen (49/71/68), Alexis Ajinca (43)

RETIRED PLAYER POLICY
I decided not to "retire" any players until after my opening day roster (12-25).  After that they will be reduced to 25 in all ratings to ensure teams do not sign them in any Association modes.

RETIRED LIST (*Denotes Unofficial)
PG: Earl Boykins (72/PG)*, T.J. Ford (68)
SG: Brandon Roy (78), Maurice Ager (56)
SF: Peja Stojakovic (59), Morris Peterson (58/SF)*
PF: Antonio McDyess (65), James Posey (64)*, Joe Smith (56)*
C: Zydrunas Ilgauskas (64), Etan Thomas (56/C)*, Theo Ratliff (53/C)*, Sean Marks (49), Malik Allen (47/C)*


109 comments:

Jk said...

Yo 'Shidi, great work as always for the past so many years.
I usually agree with most of your ratings, not agreeing with all of them so far, but I'll wait to pass judgement untill I see the real thing. One that inmediately stands out tho, is Pau Gasol...

Pau Gasol an 82... while Amare an 84??? Could you explain that?

I Mean Pau is a way way better defender, way better rebounder, better passer, and better shooter from every position but 3-9 feet (and only by 2% then); So in a game that favors all around for ovr rating, how could Amare be higher than Pau?


P.d I don't even care about the lakers, I'm a mavs fan, I think Dirk should be rated higher ( because outside rebounding and mid-range that were overrated, he should probably be higher on pretty much everything else) but I'll wait to see his actual numbers, but Pau vs Amare really stood out to me

Rashidi said...

Amare Stoudemire
Inside Scoring: B+
Outside Scoring: A-
Perimeter Defense: C+
Post Defense: B+
Ball Handling: C-
Rebounding: C+
Basketball IQ: B+
Athleticism: B

Pau Gasol
Inside Scoring: B+
Outside Scoring: C+
Perimeter Defense: D+
Post Defense: B+
Ball Handling: C-
Rebounding: B+
Basketball IQ: B+
Athleticism: C-

Gasol is more or less a center masquerading as a power forward. Actually, since going to the Lakers it's where he's played the great majority of his minutes between Bynum's injuries and acting as the backup center in the rotation. It was very evident against Dallas as he was helpless trying to defend Dirk Nowitzki on the perimeter (similar to the struggles Duncan had with Dirk 5 years ago when he turned 30).

The athleticism thing and Gasol being a plodder also comes into play when you consider that most of his offense is via the post, compared to other PFs who utilize the pick and roll much more frequently. Amare can attack the basket whereas Gasol is more methodical.

They have similar shot ratings but where Amare stands out is his 3pt shot. He was 10-23 (44%) last season, with many of them coming in pressure situations where the Knicks needed a three. Not including this shot that didn't count.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2-cIn9Fnjs

Gasol by comparison is only 2-10 over the last three years (1-3 last season). The 3pt rating ultimately does give Amare an extra overall point by a couple ticks.

Gasol's shooting percentages are aided by playing w/ Kobe as he was nowhere near as efficient when playing alone in Memphis. Amare likewise was very efficient w/ Nash in Phoenix and likewise saw his efficiency stumble when he had to be the man in NY.

2K counts blocks fairly heavily and Amare has the edge on Gasol there (which is also why his post defense is up there w/ Gasol). Actually Amare in general is a pretty good post defender, and defends the pick and roll pretty well (which probably comes from executing it so well offensively in Phoenix). His biggest problem is defensive awareness as he'll often lose his man, or be looking for a weakside shotblock instead of his man who just got a pass for an open 18 footer.

The main reason Gasol took a hit this season is his defense (like most Lakers, highlighted by the Dallas series) wasn't up to snuff. I don't think Gasol has the quickness to keep up with modern PFs now in his 30s, and it doesn't help that he's flanked by Andrew Bynum who is even slower.

Gasol IS a player I'm looking to boost though, as I don't believe for a moment he should have a lower rating than say, Eric Gordon. It's just very difficult sometimes using 2K's occasionally flawed formula as sometimes a legit all-star will slip through the cracks and not have as high an Overall rating as he deserves.

Wilson said...

Hope you can post all Rookies stat for nba 2k12..

diZ said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
diZ said...

I'm really looking forward to your roster update... any idea yet how long it will be before you will release the first one? On a side note, I'm really really wondering how you will edit dwade as i can't seem to get anything with this guy anymore since his shot is so horrible now and layups seem to get blocked on the regular :(

Jk said...

You can't really judge someone's defense based on how he defended Dirk tho, or the heat would need their numbers dropped too.

Amare has way more athleticism, and better dunking and attacking the basket (altho this doesnt translate to a better inside FG%).

You say Amare is a far better outside scorer (A- to C+) yet from Hoopdata:

10-15 feet
Amare: 38,3% 0,9 made per game
Pau: 43,3& 1 made per game

16-23 feet
Amare: 44% 2.4 made per game
Pau: 49% 1.3 made per game

I'd give the nod to Pau, or at least not a A- to C+ advantage to Amare by no means.

I really dont see why Amare's 0.1 3p made per game should be taken in consideration, specially when the year before he shot .167 from 3. It was probably just a fluke as he is a career 24.5% shooter from 3 vs Pau's 22% and he has a whooping 6 more 3's made in his career, so where's the advantage really?

You have them both as C- in ballhandling yet Pau averages over twice as many assists per game as Amare career-wise (and way less TO too), and if it's just last year Amare comes from a below average Assist Rate (10,17), and a career high in turnovers (3,2) vs Pau's Career low in turnovers (1,7) and way above average AR (18,89)

Even if 2K counts blocks heavy, that's Amare's 1.9 per game to Pau's 1.6, theres really not that much of a difference (even more if you remember the 2 previous years Amare posted 1.1 blocks per game and is a career 1.5 (Vs. Pau's 1.7), and went back in the playoffs to 3 on 4 games (below 1) while Pau went back to his career average with 17 in 10, even having a bad series)

But most importantly Amare allowed 0,91 points per possesion in the post on 46,3% shooting (league ranked 179), while Pau was 0,81 PPP on 44,1% (league ranked 93), so Pau's post defense rating should be considerably higher.

PnR wise again, Amare allows 0,92 PPP (59th league wise wich is actually surprisingly good and DEFINITELY comes from PnRin' with Nash. Too bad Nash didn't learn to do the same) but Pau's is considerably better with 0,84 PPP (37th overall).

Even if you want to go to 3P defending, opponents shot a ridiculous 45.1% vs Amare, to 36.2% against Pau (and that's on similar 3P's Made, 41 to 38); so what exactly would make Amare a better Perimeter defender?

And I don't even remember what's basketball IQ, but it really shouldnt be close, Amare's game is completely onedimensional, more turnover prone, and less team oriented, basically Hyper ADD kid vs Pau's methodical.

I Sincerely don't see any evidence to think Amare should be rated higher in any stat other than Dunking, Offensive Awareness, Athleticism stats, and then Blocks and 3p for like 5 points each (and thats only if he keeps up from last year's fluky stats) out of them all.

I really don't think Pau should be like rated next to Dwight or something, but he at least should be whatever Amare is +5, he is a far better, way more complete player that would benefit in this pro-all around, overall rating system.

Jk said...

On a second note I can't believe how much Rose improved on defense last season, I don't like him, don't agree with the mvp, and the miami series showed his offense is too one-dimensional, but god he went from a mediocre or below average defender to an elite one in a year, at least statistics wise, without taking in consideration help defense, I don't think there was a better defensive guard other than Tony Allen, or there was?

Same for Dirk, but Dirk was actually a progression, as his rebounding dropped (in his defense he has to split rebounds with some of the best rebounders at their position, Marion (Best SF on Total Rebound Rate on the league) Kidd (Second PG on TRR overall) and Chandler (Third at Center) (all out of people with more than 40gp and over 15 mpg), so his actual RPG isnt really a reflection on his rebounding skill), his post defense has become great, Rick Carlisle system has really gotten to him, he has improved slowly year by year; I suggest when you get the time, please go to Synergy and check his overall PPP given, his Opp's FG%, PnR D, Iso, Post and just everything and compare them people like Duncan and KG, you'll be surprised (Other than KG's PnR D of course, but for real, go and compare on synergy).

All while being a legendary shooter, overall offensive masterpiece with fantastic post game (specially ridiculous high post), really good ballhandling (8th lowest turnover rate out of every PF even tho he has such a high usage rate and pretty much every possesion runs through him at some point), really good passing (only 5 PF's in the whole league netted more assists even tho none of them was a primary offensive weapon or finisher unlike him), and just the clutchest and capable of taking over above other superstars... give him some love man... 86 WAY too low

Rashidi said...

Gasol's obviously had problems guarding more players than just Dirk, though Dirk in particular did torch him for 6-7 FG, 1 TO, and one And 1 in Isolation during the playoffs.

Gasol Synergy Defense
100% Overall 0.91 - 264th
35.6% Postup 0.81 - 91st
29.8% Spotup 1.04 - 261st
18.3% Isolation 0.91 - 243rd
9.5% Pick&Roll 0.84 - 37th

Amare Synergy Defense
100% Overall 0.96 - 397th
35.6% Postup 0.91 - 179th
29.1% Spotup 1.13 - 332nd
22.0% Isolation 0.87 204th
8.3% P&Roll 0.92 - 59th

I reviewed their ratings and Gasol's PostDef (+5) was underrated while Amare's DefAwr (-3) and PostDef (-2) were slightly overrated.

Gasol
82 Overall (0)
Post Defense: A- (up)

Amare
84 Overall (-1)
Post Defense: B (down)

Hopefully that should dissolve that issue. There is more that goes into those defense grades, like steal and block rating, both of which Amare trumps Gasol at.

Rashidi said...

In general Jk you are mis-utilizing many of these stats and how they would be implemented into ratings.

Shot volume matters under 2K's rating scale, else Kobe would have even lower than the 78 mid-range that many fans cry about.

Thus, instead of FGM you should be looking at FGA (more specifically, adjusted per minute).

Amare per 40 mins
Inside: 6.7 FGA
Close: 7.6 FGA
Mid: 5.9 FGA
3pt: 0.3 FGA

Gasol per 40 mins
Inside: 4.9 FGA
Close: 6.9 FGA
Mid: 3.0 FGA
3pt: 0.0 FGA

Amare took twice as many mid-range shots as Gasol and 2 more shots Inside. As I said, Gasol's percentages would suffer if he took on a larger offensive load, whereas Amare's would benefit from a lesser offensive role. Hence they have similar shot ratings.

I don't see how Amare's 3pt shot can reasonably be called a fluke considering he hit 9 total over the last 5 seasons COMBINED and then hit 10 this season. He worked on the shot, never once looked uncomfortable taking it, even hit a few big ones (again note that Boston three doesn't count towards his totals). He won some 3pt shootout in China over the summer so it's something he continues to work on. All told, there's no reason to treat it any different from any other player that showed a better 3pt stroke. As with the other shot ratings, volume is taken into account.

More importantly, while that 3pt rating might give Amare a better "Outside Scoring" rank, it does little to affect his overall rating, which is your primary complaint. It takes 55 points of 3pt to raise PF overall by 1 point, and since Amare clearly had a much better 3pt year than Gasol any way you slice it, this is a dead issue.

Rashidi said...

You address passing when talking about "Ball Handling" but didn't go over their actual "ball handling" ability. Amare is a faceup player and has much better handles than Gasol (who is a back to the basket player for a reason). Amare isolated on 32% of his possessions while Gasol isolated on only 5%.

I also would not compare the turnover rates of a first option and a second option. Gasol posted a career low TO rate for a reason. His TO rate dropped considerably the moment he went from Memphis to being Kobe's sidekick. Sure, Gasol has soft hands and is a good passer, but he isn't going to turn the ball over taking someone off the dribble because he can't take someone off the dribble in the first place.

Amare Advanced Stats
22.7 PER
56.5 TS%
7.8 ORB%
17.6 DRB%
13.2 AST%
1.2 STL%
3.8 BLK%

12.5 TO%
30.9 USG% (7th in league)

Gasol Advanced Stats
23.3 PER
58.9 TS%
10.3 ORB%
20.5 DRB%
15.1 AST%
0.8 STL%

3.3 BLK%
9.8 TO%
21.3 USG%

When one factors in the massive USG% gap, it basically cancels out the minimal differences in TS% and TO%.

Made the following adjustments based on 2K's scales

Amare
Overall (-1)
Block (-4)
Steal (-2)
ORB (-1)
DRB (-1)

Gasol
Overall (0)
Block (-1)
Steal (-2)
ORB (-3)

That brings Amare down to 83 overall. The only thing we have left to discuss is Athleticism. In other words, there is nothing left to discuss, because Amare blows Gasol out of the water in Speed, Quickness, Strength, Vertical, Layups, and Dunking, none of which can really be disputed. I'm not going to bother checking how many points of overall that gives Amare over Gasol because it ultimately doesn't matter. 2K's overall rating and ability grades are not perfect and should not be treated as such. As long as the players perform as they are expected to, there isn't much else to be said.

Rashidi said...

Dirk Nowitzki
Inside Scoring: B+
Outside Scoring: A+
Perimeter Defense: C+
Post Defense: B+
Ball Handling: C+
Rebounding: C-
Basketball IQ: A+
Athleticism: C+

Average PF
Inside Scoring: B
Outside Scoring: C
Perimeter Defense: C-
Post Defense: B-
Ball Handling: D+
Rebounding: B+
Basketball IQ: B
Athleticism: C+

If you're looking for reasons why he's only an 86, that would be the main one.

Rashidi said...

Not to mention, 55 points of 3pt to get a 1 pt overall boost. A fair scale should honestly be like 20-1. Players like Dirk, Bargnani, Ryan Anderson, etc get penalized every year because 2K doesn't think their incredibly valuable skillset should make a difference in rating

2K's Overall formula remains the main obstacle to getting 90+ rating for Dirk. It is not perfect. For most players it works but the ones it doesn't work for usually stand out.

Rashidi said...

DiZ,

The main thing edited w/ Wade was his defense which is too high. He had a great block/steal season a couple years ago but has never repeated the success. He is an above average defender but he is not exactly lockdown either.

I haven't tried using Wade, and when I played against the Heat the CPU opted to shoot 30 times w/ Lebron and only 9 w/ Wade, so I didn't really get a feel for any change in Wade's offensive game.

It is certainly worth noting that Wade is taking fewer mid-range shots since 2009 when he lead the league in scoring. His poor jump shooting was one of the biggest offensive flaws of the team last year, as it allowed teams to sag off LeBron with few other options to spread the floor.

J_Paco said...

Rashidi, when will your first update be available? What do you think abot the implementation of player "abilities" instead of numbered ratings? Wil youl edit them for every player along with ratings? I believe they've done an alright job, but certain guys abilities are overrated.

diZ said...

thx for the reply. i trust your judgement for whatever changes you make :)so do you have any prediction for your first 2k12 roster release?

Jk said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Jk said...

So a 0.7 Total rebounding rate difference between Amare and Dirk, Dirk being the 11th worst overall PF in TRR 12, while Amare is the 15th worst with 12.7 amounts to a C- vs B+ ?

That's without counting that yeah, Amare has Melo, but Dirk has the best SF in TRR in the league on Marion, the second best PG in TRR in Kidd, and the third best C TRR in the league in Chandler, yeah Amare got one more rebound per game but you have to factor who are they sharing rebounds with. the difference shouldnt be C- to B+ between the 11th and 15th worst TRR PF on the league.

Aprreciate the Pau vs Amare updates, I guess 2k system just doesn't value players like that, I'll wait to see how Amare's 3p turns out this season, cause like you said if shot volume matters for 2k, so lets see if he shoots 0,1 per game again or uses it a lil more. same for their actual blocks.

I didn't know 2k Valued shot volume for shot ratings, thought volume's depended entirely on tendencies and the like, I guess the only way to know how does their shooting turn out in game is wait till you finish every player and sim to see if we end up closer to having pau shoot better percentages from everywhere but close, on a similar volume of shots made per game (except mid range where he would have significantly lower volume).

Their usage difference was spot on, Pau should have better passing (Higher AS% on far lower usage) but his actual dribbling and handling should be similar or lower since he doesnt end up trying to beat anyone off the dribble

Rashidi said...

J_Paco,

I have not yet tackled abilities because to effectively do it I would really need an Excel sheet of the entire league to make comparisons.

So the Overall ratings I am posting are certainly not finalized as they are only dealing w/ the ratings. However the effect on overall won't be THAT great since they really only represent a couple ratings (namely, Ball Handling and Post Offense). Nothing more than a point for most players, because I highly doubt there are that many players that 2K badly screwed up on, aside from a random scrub center who can post up but 2K gave "Poor" in everything (Garret Sliler is likely one such player though I haven't bothered to check).

Rashidi said...

So a 0.7 Total rebounding rate difference between Amare and Dirk, Dirk being the 11th worst overall PF in TRR 12, while Amare is the 15th worst with 12.7 amounts to a C- vs B+ ?

Jk,

Dirk is the absolute worst offensive rebounding PF/C in the NBA, ahead of only Brian Scalabrine who never plays and is probably not coming back to the league anyway.

ORBs do not make up a large chunk of "Total REB%" since most boards are DRB. Dirk has an edge in DRB but Amare is the much better ORBer.

Vertical also counts towards the rebounding grade. Which helps explains Amare's higher grade.

Rashidi said...

I also appreciate the questioning. I'm not perfect and with 400+ players to edit I sometimes miss stuff. Whatever leads to greater accuracy of my rating/rosters, the better.

Jamal G. said...

First off, excellent stuff.

Yet, I wonder how did the gap between Golden State and Portland increase three-fold when you said the following regarding the stock team ratings: "Warriors better than the Blazers with healthy Greg Oden and Raymond Felton replacing Andre Miller?"

Lunatic Wolf said...

Can you quickly explain your changes to Hayward?

Rashidi said...

Gordon Hayward
Offense 71
Defense 55 (up from 49)
Rebound 43 (down from 50)

Rashidi said...

Just uploaded the first roster for Xbox 360

File Name: The Real NBA 2K12
GT: Real 2K Insider

güschtl said...

great news! though i play on pc.

"PC: Currently unavailable"

i suppose you'll be releasing a pc roster?

diZ said...

ps3 is where it's at ;) when is the ps3 one coming out? :(

John Banvard said...

Hey Rashidi, great work. I was wondering did you forget to add and/or create Klay Thompson to the Warriors? Also why isn't David West in the free agent pool?

ffaacc03 said...

Remember that the roster is a work in progress, only the listed players were edited ... the missing caps and rest of players and rotation edits will be done in time.

ffaacc03 said...

By the way, Rashidi, some 360 user who knows hex editing told me that he did some tweaks to your uploaded roster in order for teams to have accurate default colors on home and away accesories ... he told me to ask you if you would like to use that roster file as base for your upcoming updates ? ... he allegedly didnt do any other edits and such files dont seem to be corrupted nor "hacked", so no apparent risk of getting it blocked.

If interested, will tell him to upload the file to 2kshare and will give you his tag for you to download it.

ffaacc03 said...

Some comments/questions/request from your OS thread:

-----
Im curious to know if he's worked at all with player abilities. I was shocked to find they effect a players overall, in some cases drastically. Has he said anything about that?

I find it shocking that 2K used the words "poor, average, good, and great" to factor in to the overall of a player, because these are obviously opinion based and seem to be more of tendencies to me. Any thoughts on this from him?

-----
Would it be possible to post his rookie ratings, even if its just the first rounders?

... about lowering player potentials. Simulating multiple Associations it has shown itself to be a HUGE problem, even extending to screwing up trade logic. Any fixes for this in the works?

Juke said...

Hey are you planning on editing FA's too? Reason I asked because I don't see Wilson Chandler lister on the list (nor the unedited list)

Rashidi said...

Thanks for the catch John.

I didn't release free agents whom I expect the team to re-sign. I expect the Hornets to keep only one of West and Landry, and am undecided on which. I think West will stay because Landry seems to have a bigger market (with LaMarcus Aldridge asking fans on twitter if he would be a good fit) but am on the fence about it since West also has his suitors (Nets, Pacers). It's also possible neither re-signs and the Hornets end up selling Chris Paul for every last drop of blood they can squeeze out.

Rashidi said...

FF,

I have no interest in using any other roster as a base since they all are missing the official rookies.

Rashidi said...

FF,

Abilities are ratings.

Poor = 40
Average = 60
Good = 80
Great = 95

They will not operate as tendencies as they only affect the quality of the moves, not the frequency.

Rashidi said...

Juke,

I would prefer to focus on players who are on NBA teams for obvious reasons, though I will likely be forced to edit guys like Chandler and J.R. Smith sooner rather than later due to the impact they have in Association free agency.

Case in point, I ran an association and the Hawks signed J.R. Smith. They then traded Kirk Hinrich and moved Joe Johnson to starting PG (even though I had changed his 2nd position to SF). They also signed the retired Antonio McDyess. The team ended up winning the championship.

Ex Lion Tamer said...

Hey Rashidi, I've been using your ratings since 2K7 and that I appreciate the work year after year.

I do have a question though: how do you calculate offensive/defensive awareness? When I edit the rosters, I mostly use it to match the overall ratings to the players' caliber, but I know that can't be good for realistic gameplay!

Lockback said...

Any ETA on when your going to have fixed salaries? I know the CBA isn't done (and may not be done this season), but it'd be nice to play a real association with your guys.

Rashidi said...

Ex Lion Tamer,

A magician never reveals his secrets ;)

Though you are correct, the "caliber" of the player's offense/defense is taken into account.

Rashidi said...

Lockback,

No ETA right now. I just completed one team's ratings (Knicks) and now would like to work on their tendencies to see if I can get them playing properly. As it stands now Melo and Amare have 99 Touch tendency but in every game I sim Melo takes 30+ shots while Amare takes 10-12. Gameplay matters quite a bit more than some rookie contracts that could honestly be edited in about 30 dedicated minutes. Not really a priority since we have another lockout deadline coming up that will determine whether these guys are getting signed shortly or not.

ffaacc03 said...

Hi, Rashidi:

Just wanted to share with you this spreadsheet, of a sim test regarding how potential affects progression, made by an OSer.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AnAdl2HqQs1-dFFFYVI4bmM4dnFLNUNkTHpSNWRYZXc&hl=en_US#gid=0

Within such test, something interesting became evident, a player height has a say on the Overall rating. He created exact copies of a player rated 60 and then only varied the copies height and weight, editing the first (not with the second) reflected
an increase on overall once past a given number.

This may only be related to caps in draftclasses, may be an intentional result produced by 2k to try and expand what is already a court advantage into the offcourt or may be a bug.

Anyways, whom better than you to share this finding with.

Rashidi said...

FF,

Stop defending me on OS. If users want to ask me something directly they can contact me right here.

diZ said...

when do you show the love for the ps3? ;)

Jaycee said...

Rashidi,

Numbers look good. May I ask what changes you did with Chandler? And Dirk? So I could bump the Mavs now while PS3 set is not yet released.

ffaacc03 said...

Sincerely sorry my friend, will do that no more, didnt wanted to cause you any disconfort.

From now on, will keep sending people here and to your twitter account.

Rashidi said...

Anytime a link or long comment gets posted it automatically gets flagged as spam and won't appear until I manually review it.


I was aware of height affecting overall last year, in fact I believe I was the first to uncover that. Of course I'm sure OS missed out since I'm here and not there.

feral said...

PC: Currently unavailable

Does it mean you are going to make a pc version soon?

Thanks.

DatBoiKe said...

Shidi, great work man! I noticed there are a few players on your list that you updated but there ratings are different from the rosters I downloaded from 2Kshare. Most of the are on Dallas: Terry, Fernandez, and Mahinmi. There ratings did change. Is there a other roster you will upload with those changes?

Thanks

Rashidi said...

Finished the Lakers ratings. I have a new job which has cut into my editing time quite a bit. I should have more time now that the dust is starting to settle.

Rashidi said...

Finished Heat ratings/tendencies yesterday

diZ said...

most important team ;) when will this be available for ps3?

Dash said...

when are you doing the bulls ratings?

Rashidi said...

Thunder, Nuggets, Bulls ratings are done.

Jamal G. said...

Does the listing of Bosh's rating as a SF mean that you have changed his secondary position to such? If so, can you explain why?

ffaacc03 said...

Hi, Rashidi ... just sent you a message through your mail account.

Rashidi said...

No Jamal. It's pointing out that position overall ratings are awful, and if you think a player is low, he has ability but it isn't being properly reflected by 2K's weak formulas. Obviously in real life Bosh is not a better SF than he is a PF.

Jamal G. said...

Understood. Thanks for the quick response.

Rashidi said...

New roster uploaded to XBox 360's 2K Share (Details in blog post)

cigamodnalro said...

Hey Rashidi, great work as usual. Quick question: Do you plan on making a PC roster as well? For 2k12, I decided to go with the PC version due to the abundance of mods and such, and would really like to play with your roster. And if you are planning on it, when will it be out? Thanks! :)

Mose said...

Why is lebron still a 98 and at least in the 80 of offensive clutch? He played horrible in the finals he's still the best talent in the league but a 98 seems high and he was no where near clutch last year 80s seems too high

Dash said...

Mayo to the Pacers for McRoberts and Rush.
Paul to the Clippers for Aminu, Bledsoe, Kaman and 2012 1st (from Minnesota)

Dash said...

Or maybe not. Hearing the deal is off. Lol NBA is crazy this year.

Rashidi said...

Regarding LeBron's clutch


http://www.82games.com/1011/10MIA9.HTM#clutch

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgLMI784M4E&feature=related

Rashidi said...

Nothing is planned right now for a PC roster. I'm still converting my data over to spreadsheets which is what would be required for a quick PC transition with... I forget the name of the tool but it's how you can input the data quickly.

Rashidi said...

Another update is out, I'm basically doing daily updates right now.

güschtl said...

tools' name is REDitor

release date TBA...

...would be great to have your ratings in excel sheets anyway

Jamal G. said...

Rashidi, is the plan at this time to only release a PS3 file when the roster is complete?

Rashidi said...

Work won't start on PS3 roster until the missing rookies are all added. This includes 2nd rounders. Hopefully 2K will make some progress there since they only have 3-4 more first rounders to add.

HeadAtTheRim said...

Whats your PSN so i can look out for your roster on the PS3 when they drop

Rashidi said...

I am currently three PSN possibilities. Won't release the tag until any decisions are made.

Caveman said...

NBA Fantasy League:

http://basketball.fantasysports.yahoo.com/nba/register/tos?league_id=101342&password=basketballreasons

Rashidi, this is to you in particular. Would know to be in a Fantasy League with you.

TK said...

Rashidi,

Do you have any idea how to address the issue of APG stats in simulated games? If you sim a season with 2k's official roster you'll find something like the following:

PG APG Pass Rating
Nash 7.1 98
Williams 6.3 95
Paul 6.7 94
Kidd 11.2 93

What the hell is going on here? I thought this might be due to coach offense rating, playbooks, or coach profiles, but it doesn't. Trade the whole roster of the Clippers for the whole roster of the Mavericks and you'll still see CP3 with 7 APG and Kidd with 11.

You being the consumate roster maker, I think you'd have to agree that getting the simmed stats as close to right as possible is one of the most important indicators of a roster's quality- rosters have a large effect in-game as well, but there are always sliders to fine-tune that. Simmed stats appear to rely wholly on rosters.

Now, there must be a way to get high numbers of assists, since some PGs like Kidd or Conley have much higher APG than they ought to. I've found two ways to improve on the issue:

1. Shot tendency, of both the PG and his teammates. Reducing shot tendency on the PG will reliably raise assists. CP3 can get 10 APG with a shot tendency of 0. Obviously not a complete solution but Williams and Paul do have shot tendencies too high and that will help. This also explains some Kidd's excessive assist numbers- his shot tendency has attempting less than half as many shots as he should. Fixing teammates is also important. Many role players, like Kidd, have shot tendencies far too low. DeAndre Jordan attempts around a third as many shots as he should. By fixing this, Paul or Williams can get to around 7.5 APG.

2. Draw Foul Tendency. You'll notice in a simmed season team FTA will range from like 2500-3300. This leads to fewer FGA and about 10-15% less assists on a global basis. Team fouls are a bit high but not enough to explain all the FTA, so the answer is draw foul tendency. If you look closely at the simmed stats of most role players you'll find they shoot way more FTA per FGA than they ought to. A lot of stars are closer to correct on FTA/FGA but many are too high as well.

I've managed to get Paul, Williams, and Nash in the low 8 APG range with those adjustments. The rest has been tougher to figure out. It appears to come down to teammates. Trade Williams or Paul to the Mavericks or Grizzlies and their APG jumps by 2 or more. Kidd on the Clippers is back down to 7-8 APG. What is it about the ratings and tendencies of the SG thru C positions on the Mavs and Grizzlies that makes their PG able to get good assist numbers, that teams like the Clippers or Nets don't have? CP3's Clippers often lead the league in assists, so it can't be low team assists, and Griffin averages 1/3 the assists he should despite a decent pass rating. I'm at a loss to explain it. This aspect of the game is vital to me, though of course most players seem to care more about sleeves and tats and shoes. I figured if anyone had the knowledge of this game to address this it you be you, the Real2kInsider. Therefore I ask you: Are you aware of these issues? Is your roster going to address them?

Rashidi said...

I don't pay much attention to sim stats because it's infinitely more important for the players to play as they should on the court.

Rashidi said...

Run Plays slider probably affects it. Not to mention the shot tendencies of teammates.

MiguelFerreira said...

Can you give all Stiemsma stats ?

Phiology said...

hey, great rosters, best i've found until now.

question: could you probably convert/make the roster changes to/for the pc-version?

i'm not asking you to update on any platform every few days as you do right now, but just for once, so the PC players can also enjoy more realistic ratings?

thanks

samuel teo said...

Its been few matches since season started. Wade stunk. Lebron doing well but dont deserve 98... more of a 96. Kobe doing fine deserve at least 95. Durant too not 88, at least 94. Anthony too 90+ Bynum 85(pls dont get this wrong), Dwight 93. Gasol 84 Stoud 84 (he stink so far.)Rose 93 fair. Lebron clutch should be below 30 pls.

Dash said...

Any updates planned for Luol Deng, Omer Asik and Carlos Boozer? (That midrange J for Boozer looking a bit low)

Corox said...

Hi Rashidi, i have a question for you on Greg Monroe : you put him at 68, don't you think he deserves better ?

He's the best Pistons player since the last all star game, and he's a top 10 Center in the league btw.

I hope you will answer :D

Thanks for the job, i used your roster last year and this one i make mine (i stay on 2k11). I will appreciate if we can talk about your formulas to compare with mine (for personnal use only, i won't buy 2k12 and i'll stay on 11 for a couple of years i think), i believe you'll do not but i'll try :D

Best regards

PS : i hope my english is correct

c63f425a-3d83-11e1-afc4-000bcdcb471e said...

Hey Rashidi,

Do you know if Synergy Sports has NCAA data too?

Thanks.

Jon said...

Hey Rashidi,

Do your rosters only work best with the default sliders?

LHSLax_D24 said...

If I download these on the 360, are all of the rookies created or are they the real ones?

Rashidi said...

Haven't checked the comments in awhile...

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I believe I addressed the Monroe question on twitter. Center rating heavily weights defense which is why Bargnani is only 68 at the position. Monroe's 71 is reasonable within that context.

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If Synergy does do NCAA it is a separate service. Probably not available to the public yet (AFAIK)

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Sliders are a personal thing

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Rookies are CAPs until the real models can be added glitch free.

Phiology said...

Hey, i asked before, but could you probably convert your rosters for the PC version?

if it isnt too big of a deal, I (and probably many more) would highly appreciate it.

Jk said...

Yo 'shidi, Reditor has already been released, are you planning on releasing a pc version anytime soon?

what's the current state, I got the feeling from reading you on twitter that every player was done? or how many are missing, thanks.

Unknown said...

Hey Rashidi I'm just wondering what all you do. Do you edit accessories? Player tendencies? Hot zones? Etc. Thanks!

Rashidi said...

Don't really bother with accessories. There's just too much gameplay related that needs to take priority. In-depth rating/tendency edits are extremely time-consuming.

Rashidi said...

Also the way reditor works (at least how it was explained in the past) is you input ratings into spreadsheet and then put it into reeditor. I am still adding all that information (ratings and tendencies) to spreadsheet so once that is completed I can get around to the PC.

kkuhlman1 said...

Great work rashidi. I was just wondering when you think you will have a roster out with real rookies from 2k instead of CAP rookies? Not that your CAP rookies are bad (they look pretty good) but I would prefer real players and I pretty much exclusively use your roster. Thanks again.

Levelthe one said...

This is soo depressing ...Brandon Knight is having a better season in every area...but the rating level is so one sided..... Brandon knight was a higher rated player coming out of college.... tracy Mcgrady get boosted? To 77 for what? Gorats 80? .... greg monroe,mcgee, 75 .....

Levelthe one said...

I meant but kemba walker!

Lunatic Wolf said...

Rashidi

You can use reditor that way, or you can just input the ratings manually into the program. Works either way.

Rashidi said...

kkuhlman1,

Won't be a consideration until all the Chinese exports return to the roster.

Rashidi said...

Levelthe one,

Brandon Knight has been awful. He is averaging 12-3-3 in 32 mpg which is not good for a starting PG (only 3 assists in 30+ minutes???). His A/T ratio is awful (1.26) and he is a below average defender that doesn't force any turnovers on that end either. His per game numbers are padded by the sheer volume of minutes he is getting, but he is LAST among all rookies in Win Shares (NEGATIVE 0.3).

All of this jives w/ what we knew about Knight coming into the year - he was a shoot first PG and not much of a play maker as a college freshman, so expecting him to become one at the NBA level at 19 years of age was simply not realistic. He might be a good player in a couple of years, but right now he is a big reason why Detroit is one of the league's worst teams despite some talent on paper (Monroe, Stuckey, Prince)



This is soo depressing ...Brandon Knight is having a better season in every area...but the rating level is so one sided..... Brandon knight was a higher rated player coming out of college.... tracy Mcgrady get boosted? To 77 for what? Gorats 80? .... greg monroe,mcgee, 75 .....

Levelthe one said...
I meant but kemba walker!

Rashidi said...

Brandon Knight
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/k/knighbr03.html
10.4 PER
49.3 TS%
1.3 ORB%
12.5 DRB%
20.0 AST%
1.2 STL%
0.5 BLK%
18.1 TO%
22.2 USG%

Kemba Walker
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/w/walkeke02.html
14.6 PER
46.8 TS%
2.2 ORB%
13.6 DRB%
22.9 AST%
1.7 STL%
0.9 BLK%
12.1 TO%
24.7 USG%


Kemba has struggled badly with his shot but everything else he's been better than Knight at (and it's not like Knight is shooting the ball well either).

Rashidi said...

McGrady is having his best season since his injury plagued 2009. He is a very well-rounded player (albeit one that can't play a heavy load of minutes) and that plays into SF Overall rating. At default his 55 Defensive Awareness is very underrated.

Marcin Gortat
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/g/gortama01.html
21.4 PER
58.6 TS%
8.9 ORB%
25.5 DRB%
4.9 AST%
0.9 STL%
3.9 BLK%
10.6 TO%
21.0 USG%

Gortat is widely underrated across the league and is all-star caliber in the west. He is a great finisher on the P/R and an excellent defender.

Greg Monroe
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/monrogr01.html
24.2 PER
58.6 TS%
13.9 ORB%
23.5 DRB%
15.7 AST%
2.5 STL%
1.4 BLK%
15.3 TO%
24.3 USG%

Monroe is a good scorer and passer. However 2K's Overall rating for centers values defense first and foremost. Monroe's block rate is awful for a center. Monroe suffers from David Lee syndrome - he can score at C but he cannot handle the defensive responsibilities of the position, which will doom him to putting up great numbers on losing teams if the team can't find a legit starting C. Andrea Bargnani had 68 Overall last year for the same reason, so a 75 for Monroe shows how much better a rebounder he is.

JaVale McGee
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mcgeeja01.html
19.1 PER
52.5 TS%
11.6 ORB%
23.5 DRB%
3.2 AST%
1.4 STL%
7.5 BLK% (2nd in league)
13.5 TO%
19.8 USG%

McGee conversely is a great shot blocker, but isn't much of an offensive player beyond his impressive dunks.

J_Paco said...

What have you thought of Kawhi Leonard and when can we expect a rating for him? I don't know what the raw or advanced stats say, but from observing many Spurs games he's an elite rebounder (at his position), impressive perimeter defender (best on the Spurs) and can actually play both wing positions. His ball-handling is pretty solid as well. On the negative side, he doesn't finish well in traffic, isn't very athletic or explosive and his jump shot is very shaky. I would love to read your opinion.

Rashidi said...

Paco I accidentally deleted your comment while I was reading it. Sorry about that. Got halfway through and it mentioned why Tony Parker's rating is lower than Stephen Curry.

Stephen Curry
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/curryst01.html
21.5 PER
58.6 TS%
2.7 ORB%
11.9 DRB%
33.8 AST%
3.0 STL%
1.0 BLK%
17.1 TO%
23.5 USG%

Tony Parker
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/parketo01.html
22.0 PER
51.8 TS%
1.4 ORB%
8.3 DRB%
40.6 AST%
1.7 STL%
0.2 BLK%
12.1 TO%
28.6 USG%

They are both very good players, but as we all know, very different stylistically. Curry is a better shooter, Parker the better slasher and playmaker. I would say the one thing that puts Curry's rating ahead of Parker right now is his steal rate which is much better than Parker's. Parker has never forced many turnovers (career 1.6 STL% to Curry's 2.4%). Even with a bum ankle Curry has always been able to force turnovers even if his man defense is occasionally suspect.

feral said...

Can you tell us when you are gonna release the pc version of your roster? Looking forward to it! Thx

Jk said...

Yo 'Shidi, I was wondering, did you edit player tendencies for every player?.

I know you use hoopdata/bball reference for the basic stuff, like shot locations, rebounding, assists, steals, rebounds.

But did you edit every single attributte? What source did you use for things like Vertical, or speed, quickness, hustle, etc, or you left those untouched?

Do you have an estimate release for PC version? man it's been half a season and haven't been able to use your edits, you are killing pc users.

Rashidi said...

I actually tried out Reditor last week but absolutely did not understand it. I'm going to need somebody to teach me how to use it properly, otherwise find someone willing to put in all the values.

Jaysen said...

Jeremy Lin.. Has he been playing like a PG deserving of 83 OVR, statistically? I've been watching him play and he's unstoppable 1on1 and on defense he's a terror, at least when it comes to steals. He has a knack for the ball.. a quality all greats seem to have. Did I mention he's leading the Knicks and has the city believing a championship can be won, this year. The addition of JR Smith has elevated the team inmho into contenders, if TChandler stays healthy of course.

Levelthe one said...

I appreciate you responding....my point isn't that knight is having a great season its that kemba walker rating is too high! When you compare player to player and stat to stat.... in the fantasy league knight has been a higher rated player more often.... keep knight at 68...but bring walker down to 68 also is what I'm saying

Levelthe one said...

I'm not judging you or what you do...imma straight pistons homer.....but I love the 2k and play with several teams....

But if mcgrady is going to get boosted for bouncing back from injuries should jonas jerebeko of the pistons get boosted? Monroe is not a shot blocker but leads the league in STEALS for big men switch speaks to his awareness..... some say Monroe is one of the best offensive young big men in the league I just think he is an 80....but you guys do a great job at what you do....and I still win with my pistons...it would just be easier if the rating where adjusted a little better

Levelthe one said...

He averages almost 7 turnovers ppg ....unheard of for a PG that needs to be takin into account

Jaysen said...

I agree.. He's fearless with the ball and is learning how to pass in the NBA. He also tends to hold on to the ball when the double comes. He also runs into double coverage and gets it stolen that way too. All in all he's the best PG 23 or under in the NBA. I guess you can lower his pass rating to maybe 78 or his offensive awareness to maybe 86. I agree his turnovers are a wee bit high but his workload did increase drastically. He'll make the necessary adjustments and will be just fine. Whether he figures it out this year, idk..

Levelthe one said...

Question......do you think it far to adjust the foul call up slighty...if people have mastered steal the ball and riding you out of bounds but yet they receive no fouls?

RyAn said...

rashidi great work as usual....any progress on the spreadsheet converson? i would definitley love to transfer your ratings to a pc roster...

pk20 said...

It's easy to come up with better ratings then for the 2011-2012 NBA season when your doing it in march instead of august lol. This is a joke, you just took his ratings and adjusted for what actually happened. If I could pick my fantasy team in march, I'd look like I was better then the experts too lol. There is nothing special about what yup did here, and the 2k12 rankings are incredibly well done

Rashidi said...

Ratings are done all season, not 3 months later. Which is what 2K Sports also attempts to do.